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problem withdrawing from college class


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Joined: Nov 03, 2005
Posts: 69138
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Posted Jan 24, 2004 at 11:57:43 PM
Subject: problem withdrawing from college class

Your suggestions would be appreciated--

my son signed up for a college class at a community college which he never participated in. We realized he hadn't officially withdrawn. I called and the registrar's office said it was a little past the deadline. I explained that he has ADHD (documented) and that learning executive function skills is something he's working on. She said she would take care of it and said she was fixing it on his record as we spoke. Now the school says $480 is due and has assigned it to a collection agency. On the website, the school says once it goes to a collection agency nothing can be done. Help?

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victoria
Joined Jun 13, 2003
Posts: 1784

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Posted:Jan 25, 2004 2:02:56 AM

Well, next time, actually go into the registrar's office and get something on paper (rule 1 when dealing with bureaucracy).

This time, you could try threatening lawsuit under ADA -- sometimes just the threat works. However without documentation of the conversationyou're in a weak position.

You can also try going over their heads -- college president or provost or Dean of Students etc. etc.

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Anonymous
Joined Sep 21, 2014
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Posted:Jan 25, 2004 9:54:11 PM

I know--hindsight! he should have had it in writing. We thought of something else--at the same time, he was also working on another online course through a university which had different deadlines. I don't want to sound like he's full of excuses but I think this factored in. Also, he completed two other online courses with entirely different rules and academic calendar. What do you think?

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Anonymous
Joined Sep 21, 2014
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Posted:Jan 25, 2004 11:37:11 PM

Quote "Leslie":

Your suggestions would be appreciated--

Quote "Leslie":

my son signed up for a college class at a community college which he never participated in. We realized he hadn't officially withdrawn. I called and the registrar's office said it was a little past the deadline. I explained that he has ADHD (documented) and that learning executive function skills is something he's working on. She said she would take care of it and said she was fixing it on his record as we spoke. Now the school says $480 is due and has assigned it to a collection agency. On the website, the school says once it goes to a collection agency nothing can be done. Help?

Colleges want their money just like every other business and this one is trying to scare you and others into paying with the collection agency thing. DON"T pay it. Tell everyone who calls there's been a mistake and your son never took this course - be indignant! Tell them he withdrew from the class and you confirmed that with Mrs. Whatever her name was in the registrar's office. Fudge the truth a little bit. Emphasize over and over again that he didn't attend one single class ever. And who was it that told you they would take care of it? Drop that person's name and often and tell everybody that Mrs. so- and so assured you this wouldn't be a problem and that your son was withdrawn from the course personally by this person.

Write letters if you need to - keep copies. Eventually they'll give up. And no need to be talking about your son's ld. It has nothing to do with the matter really. Your son never attended this class. It's unconscionable that the college would charge you or him for a class he NEVER attended.

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victoria
Joined Jun 13, 2003
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Posted:Jan 26, 2004 12:05:20 AM

Sara -- either you are rather young and have little experience of colleges, or you are one of those lucky people who floats through life never getting entangled in some of the weirdnesses that others of us seem to attract.

Yes, the college does, and should, collect for classes that a person *never* once attended:
-- some students, especially the eccentric geniuses (possibly AS?) often found in math departments, sign up for classes, study on their own at home, and only show up for exams, which they ace. If the college is going to keep functioning, it needs to get paid for offering the class and the degree whether certain students want to listen to explanations or not.
-- some so-called students sign up for classes, collect student aid, and then go for a three-month long spring break. The college sets strict drop dates and charges tuition anyway in order to avoid encouraging this behaviour; they do it once but once the bills and the F's arrive they either leave or go to classes the next semester.
-- some not-too-good students sign up for a bunch of classes and then shop around and decide which are going to be easy to fake through, and then they drop the others at the last minute. The college sets strict drop dates and charges tuition anyway in order to get people into real classes and doing some work before the term is mostly over.

College administrators who work with adolescents for years have seen and heard it all. My two classics as a college instructor were a young man who excused himself for being in the emergency ward with a PCP overdose and a girl who excused herself because she had gone to a 48-hour weekend rave and she had the new tongue piercing to prove it.
You get a lot further by explaining an honest mistake as calmly as possibly (firmly, but restrained) than by screaming and demanding you are "owed" something.

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Joe Tag
Joined Sep 21, 2014
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Posted:Jan 26, 2004 9:20:16 AM

Hello, Leslie, and Everyone ---

This is Joe Tag, from Kean University ( http://www.kean.edu ) .
I also attended Union County ( New Jersey ) College <br>
( http://www.ucc.edu)
I have some advise and information.

Every student should have been using a Bulletin << published
every semester; Fall, Spring, Summer >> which
should contain Class Listings, as well as Schedule Deadlines;
i.e.: When tuition is due, when classes start, when the Drop/Add
( drop a course/add a course ) date is, the dates you can get a refund
( 100%; 75%; 50% ) . The college should confirm with the
professor involved, that your sone didn't withdraw from that
class. I think that more paperwork organization is called for
( and yes, I have problems with this, myself; keeping files straight--
at home ) . Maybe two folders/portfolios are needed (See Stapes or
Office Max ) , one for each college?

Kean University has a policy addressing attendance, and is
requiring Professors to record and submit the names of students
Not Attending. ( I work for the Political Science Department, as a
Support Staff Assistant ) .

Was your son registered with a College LD or Disability Services
Program? Why didn't he and his councellor check the dates
about the Drop/Add and Withdrawal? This is the students obligation.

Determine what documentation/paperwork and petition was filed, what
the dates were when you spoke with the College Registrar ( I agree
with the other writer, ( Victoria? ) ).

This may be an expensive lesson, in the reminder of keeping better
track of deadlines and Due Dates.

/signed/ Joseph ( Joe) Tag,Jr.

- - - - -

Your suggestions would be appreciated--

my son signed up for a college class at a community college which he never participated in. We realized he hadn't officially withdrawn. I called and the registrar's office said it was a little past the deadline. I explained that he has ADHD (documented) and that learning executive function skills is something he's working on. She said she would take care of it and said she was fixing it on his record as we spoke. Now the school says $480 is due and has assigned it to a collection agency. On the website, the school says once it goes to a collection agency nothing can be done. Help?

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Anonymous
Joined Sep 21, 2014
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Posted:Jan 26, 2004 4:11:56 PM

Thank you to everyone for your thoughts and suggestions.

I know that rules are rules are rules. Learning organizational skills is a challenge for all college students. I'm hoping this is a reminder to have calendars and files for every course taken. At the same time, I do see this as a reflection of organizational skills that are still evolving...maybe not as quickly as peers. I don't see any sense in "demanding" the change, but I do think a decision will need to be made that looks at all factors. I appreciate your time.

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Anonymous
Joined Sep 21, 2014
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Posted:Jan 27, 2004 12:17:51 PM

From: Joe Tag,Jr.
TO: Leslie.

You are very welcome.

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Anonymous
Joined Sep 21, 2014
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Posted:Jan 28, 2004 9:12:24 PM

Quote "victoria":

Sara -- either you are rather young and have little experience of colleges, or you are one of those lucky people who floats through life never getting entangled in some of the weirdnesses that others of us seem to attract.

Quote "victoria":

I taught on the college level for many years - I'm not sure about the attracting wierdnesses thing.

Quote "victoria":

Did this young man do any of the below examples that you offered? He didn't sit for exams in the class or sign up for student aid or remain in some classes while trying to drop others. None of the examples to the best of our knowledge apply to the young man in question.

Quote "victoria":

I still it think it unconscionable for the college to charge tuition to this young man and my advice to the mother would remain the same - she should refuse to pay and be the squeaky wheel until they drop their request for tuition.

Quote "victoria":

But it's a free board, as we could say, and I have no problem if your advice to her is different than mine. Differences of opinion occur as often on these boards as in life. What difference does it make really?

Quote "victoria":


Best-

Quote "victoria":

Quote "victoria":


Yes, the college does, and should, collect for classes that a person *never* once attended:
-- some students, especially the eccentric geniuses (possibly AS?) often found in math departments, sign up for classes, study on their own at home, and only show up for exams, which they ace. If the college is going to keep functioning, it needs to get paid for offering the class and the degree whether certain students want to listen to explanations or not.
-- some so-called students sign up for classes, collect student aid, and then go for a three-month long spring break. The college sets strict drop dates and charges tuition anyway in order to avoid encouraging this behaviour; they do it once but once the bills and the F's arrive they either leave or go to classes the next semester.
-- some not-too-good students sign up for a bunch of classes and then shop around and decide which are going to be easy to fake through, and then they drop the others at the last minute. The college sets strict drop dates and charges tuition anyway in order to get people into real classes and doing some work before the term is mostly over.

Quote "victoria":

College administrators who work with adolescents for years have seen and heard it all. My two classics as a college instructor were a young man who excused himself for being in the emergency ward with a PCP overdose and a girl who excused herself because she had gone to a 48-hour weekend rave and she had the new tongue piercing to prove it.
You get a lot further by explaining an honest mistake as calmly as possibly (firmly, but restrained) than by screaming and demanding you are "owed" something.

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victoria
Joined Jun 13, 2003
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Posted:Jan 29, 2004 1:03:24 AM

Sara -- my point was, I thought quite clearly, that the young man and/or his mother should explain an honest mistake as calmly as possible.

He needs to make it clear that he is *not* in any of those groups of problem students.

Demanding a rebate as a right is merely going to remind the powers that be of all the other people who have come in and given them a hard time, and make them all the more likely to just point to the rules and slam the door.

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Anonymous
Joined Sep 21, 2014
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Posted:Jan 29, 2004 9:12:30 AM

Hello. My interests on this board are: Adults with LD, Social Skills, and Post-secondary education.

Leslie ---
The discussion on Bulletin Boards can become heated.

Everyone ---
Parents are hopefully supportive of their children, as the "kids" take
college classes. I have seen several parents take a half-day from
work and go to the kids college and register the student for classes.
This is __NOT__ good for kids to grow and mature. Parents should
be involved by asking questions of the student, if they followed the rules.
That way, everyone is "in the loop" and informed.

The student should go back to Registrar and Student Accounting, after
checking with Mom when she spoke to the Registrars Office; and
then check the schedule of deadlines. The student may not get
any money back, if the "100% refund" date is passed.
The student has the obligation to know deadlines; it's part of the responsibility of being a student.

Professors also pubish the deadline dates in their syllabus, of every single class they take. If you attend the first class, and never attend any
following class-session after, you have the syllabus as reference.

Sorry if I rant and rave. Best of luck to you all. It is a tough semester.

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Anonymous
Joined Sep 21, 2014
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Posted:Jan 30, 2004 4:31:39 PM

I agree very much with the post that comes right before mine. I am, however, very sorry that I do and mean no disrespect to anyone's child. But, when you are an adult, you cannot always have your parents to help you and whatnot, you know? It would be nice if you could, but you just can't. You can't take your parents to work, you can't take your parents with you to your college classes. Guest is right because most every professor will put the drop dates and everything on their syllabus, the student will inevitably hear of these drop dates and whatnot even if they have one class they never attend. It is darn hard, I am sure, to help a young adult learn those executive type of skills with regards to keeping a schedule and organized date book, do not even get me started on how hard it is to learn how to manage family, church, school, and work and be ld as all get out. However, sometimes the parents have to just slowly let the young adult go. Slowly, and painlessly, let the young adult go and get their University learning. I feel that if you have add or a mad wicked ld or two your parents should just be there for support and supplement what the young adult is in the porcess of learning with regrds to executive functioning type of skills. It saddens me but I have seen many grown people at my University have their parents call the offices of student disabilites in order to get help as to why the young adult is failing a class that they had supplemental tutoring for but never went to..ex cetera. The young adult at the University has to learn that they cannot always have their parents to help them all the time. Sometimes you just have to fall flat on your face. And it is thsoe times that when you haven't aq choice but to fall flat on your face that the young adult learns a lesson or two and grows and matures as an adult. But, I truly do not mean any dis respect to the originator of this post or the young adult child of the originator of this post. I actually liked reading of this issue, because if I wind up having a child with my ld issues, I at least will know a tad bit more than I once did. Please note, that I am just expressing my opinion and really and truly not trying to cause anyone any discourtesy.

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Anonymous
Joined Sep 21, 2014
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Posted:Feb 02, 2004 7:38:45 PM

Hi,
I didn't expect quite so many responses and appreciate the comments.

Nothing new to add, but hopefully this can be taken care of. The thoughts that "sometimes someone needs to fall flat on their face" to learn are true. However, a $400+ bill is an excessive fall and really one that's unaffordable for never participating for a moment. I think a lot can be learned about this without paying this high fee. Parents can't always be there--true, and actually my son has spent over a year away at a college. What caused the problem here, as I mentioned, was the fact that more than one online class was going on. No one wants to hide or shirk responsibility behind a disability. However problems with executive function are not easily noticeable and really only now--as life's demands are greater--is it becoming more apparent. All the more need to learn new skills.

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Joe Tag
Joined Sep 21, 2014
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Posted:Feb 03, 2004 12:03:23 AM

Hello. Paying for college tuition is always tough.
I need a "real" corporate /
commercial job ( which might include Retail / Department Store ) .
I agree with the Guest.

One time, living at Mom's, I neglected to take care of my car registration and insurance, after an accident. The car was towed away. Because the
car was not __recently__ registered, I had to get a loan from my father
(parents being divorced) to get my car out of impound. So, I learned
the hard way, about __MAJOR__ obligations.
I pay SallieMae $48--51 dollars a month on a student loan.

Leslie ---
If necessary, and you feel up to it, pay the tuition, and make the payment
conditional as a loan to your son, who owes you the money. Because
he should have __sought__ ADVISEMENT from College/University AND
his PARENTS, and confirmation with FRIENDS about his OBLIGATIONS!
And, he may need to work extra hard during the Summer, to pay you
back, and take one less course ( $$$ ) in the Fall.. Money money money! It's tough to manage.

Peace be with you.

Joe Tag,Jr.
--- CONFIDENTIAL - THIS MESSAGE SOLELY FOR LDONLINE.ORG ---

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Anonymous
Joined Sep 21, 2014
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Posted:Mar 17, 2004 3:36:26 AM

While I can associate with the difficulties of coping with ADD, and while I do not completely agree with the high priced costs of college tuition, I do feel that you are obligated to pay the $480. Unless another factor is at play, ADD alone is not going to account for someone to miss a whole semester course.

Having ADD, and playing that card to receive help and accomodations, and in some cases special consideration, is nothing to be frowned upon...it is called creating "equal opportunity," to refference the Constitutional issue at play. From receiving extra time on tests to having college admissions counselors give you special consideration regarding your low GPA relating to your ADD, there are a wide range of things that institutions are responsible for in leveling the playingfield to equalize opportunities. We should be so lucky to receive such generous accomodations.

The thing is, when it comes to failing, losing, or having difficulties- be they part of our ADD or not, we cannot be so quick to blame them all on a condition- some of the responsibility does fall on us. If the college is nice enough, they may perhaps credit you the money, out of generosity. However, they are not obligated, and for the most part, have institutional (not economic) reasons for this...basically those listed in the previous response a month ago. We cannot allow what we suffer from to cause others to suffer. This is the basic idea.

I think, to say a little more, regarding ideas for responsibility, that anyone with ADD can think of, is that before we get involved in a situation, for example, college, we have to be prepared to accept the consequences of failing to succeed. Perhaps the school will allow him to retake the course? That's a possible idea that shows a committment to education.

To be sure, we must also ask this question: Is your son suffering? If he feels guilty about missing the classes, then he will want the opportunity to make that up. If the issue doesn't affect him, then I really don't think ADD caused him to miss the classes. One component of ADD, specifically the one that drives us to get diagnosed, is that we feel guilty about not completing things, because we suffer from our mistakes and want to right them.

Suffering through anything is difficult, and it can cost us friends, money, time, jobs, and many other things. But for all these things, we cannot expect that there is something that is going to compensate us...console, yes; help us get back on our feet, yes...but not to compensate us. In fact, I will offer that it is the very suffering that puts the carrot before the horse, so to speak, that encourages us to be proactive in solving and erradicating our suffering. The government and our laws don't compensate for our mistakes, but they allow us to recover from them and hopefully find ways to keep from repeating them.

What would possibly work is attempting to retake the class. The point here is that the education is the important issue, including working around the ADD, and the school will recognize this. I think what they have and will refuse to recognize is an avoidance of education, not that classes were skipped, but rather that your son has no desire to retake the class- thus he does fall into one of the categories that was mentioned earlier. In asking for a refund the goal of an education is lost. The school will not accept this, because the goal affected by the ADD was the education, and I am sure the school would want to keep that goal. If it's no longer the goal because of this experience, an expensive lesson has been learned- but it doesn't fall on the school to refund the money.

I don't mean to be accusatory, but hope to have shared an interesting perspective with a more thorough analysis.

Best of luck.

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LDintheOC
Joined Sep 12, 2006
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Posted:Dec 10, 2007 11:20:47 AM

I know that this is an old post but you can’t get out of paying tuition for a class that you signed up for and never attended but forgot to drop.

You can’t use your disability and say that you just forgot to drop because everyone would be using that excuse. As some of the other posters have stated there are rules regarding drop dates and tuition reimbursements. I think I had a teacher who actually snitched on a student because the student would sign up for his class and then drop it within the drop date. He suspected some kind of financial aid fraud.

If you sign up for a class and do not drop it you are taking up space for another paying potential student. Unless the institution was at fault, such as you filed to drop the class and you have the paperwork but they never processed it, other than that it is your responsibility.

If you forgot to drop the class and the instructor gave you an F and you could prove that you never attended a single day, then you might be able to appeal that F but probably not a tuition reimbursement.

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