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Teaching Students with LD and ADHD

What is his problem????


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Joined: Jun 01, 2008
Posts: 26
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Posted Jun 03, 2008 at 8:08:11 PM
Subject: What is his problem????

I could use some ideas on what my son's problem could be...he told me that when his English teacher (10th gr.) reads a book aloud to the class he has difficulty following her. He has his own book to follow along with but he says she reads too fast + there are 'big words' he doesn't understand. He is ADHD, on medicine, and went through the usual remedial reading programs in elem. school + some speech therapy for a language impairment. Recently tested again, his language skills are 'adequate', but his reading fluency is borderline and comprehension is low average. I don't know whether to look at a processing disorder, reading disorder, or in his words "am I dyslexic?" Any ideas? Thanks! Vicki

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Mandi
Joined May 05, 2008
Posts: 424

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Posted:Jun 04, 2008 3:09:12 AM

Yes i got me a good clue.... He has ORPD. A very common disability often found along with OCD dyslexia and or the goddess forbidden ADHD! That would be Over Reactive Parent Disorder.

Seriously, start by taking a few deep breaths. Whatever is going on with him, is *less* likely to work out good if you get worked up. Also, getting worked up over LD serves no good purpose as many with LD are hardly disabled. They lead full and wonderful lives many even as professionals in many fields and as academics. You are going to be ok. So is your son. If he has made it this long, with a little help he will make it though. But if your lose it, so will he. You set the tone. How you do that is by staying calm, no matter what is happening.

First of all don't worry about Dyslexia. It sounds to me unlikely as from what i know about it, it seems to affect written and read language far more than verbal and auditory issues. It sounds to me, like his teacher is just another boring old bat with no business teaching, combined with the issue of another kind that is simple to fix. It sounds as if his vocabulary is behind or that his teacher is teaching non grade apropriate books. This is easy to solve. Get his book from his teacher in advance. Give him from the texts, vocabulary words to look up and learn. You can't get too hyper about it just a small handfull at a time.

As you say he is ADHD, there is no evidence of the organic existence of this disorder what so ever that has not been refuted by real and proper science of a non seudo nature. He may have trouble focusing.... I have my own personal theory about this disorder. I think, when a child is over exposed to hyper reactions they learn to always be on edge and just unfocused and impulsicve and copying the example which their earliest education exposed them to. I think ADHD is a learned behavior. And then when the parent freaks out further when the kid exhibits symptoms the symptoms continue to get worse as the child's education continues. But again, i am NOT an expert. I am just a woman who according to some has ADHD and according to others is fine. Not only am i supposed to be ADHD, but i am also a literally clinically dyslexic epigrapher who is passably to fluently literate in 6 additional languages (as my epigraphy focus is hieroglyphs hieratic script, and old coptic.) Also i am fluent in both ancient greek music notation as well as modern western music notation. These labels hold only the power you allow them to hold over your life as there is *no* evidence of any sort of brain difference of shape or structure or function which is accepted as proof of this disorder of ADHD anyway.

I don't know what it is.... But if he isn't making a mess of his letters, and he can read well enough to decode the words then it is likely in my opinion from what little i know, not dyslexia. As for comprehension.... I don't know... It sounds like he isn't overly verbal so possibly not so auditory? Maybe he would do better if he had a dictionary on hand read the book himself and looked up every word he finds that he doesn't know. The other possibility is, his teacher's taste in books blows the big one, and he is bored to tears.

If his reading skills are borderline i am afraid i don't know what you mean... Borderline grade level???? Border line what exactly? If grade level is your meaning maybe a tutor would help? I recoommed a Barbey doll that wears indecent shirts and has a very sexy accent. Suddenly all that ADHD will likely magically disapear.... I am sure too that if she likes the text he will find it very interesting rather suddenly. Hormones and teenagers...

I personally doubt anything is wrong with him. And even if he *is* dyslexic... uhhh so what??? What difference does it make? What matters is finding an understanding of what methodology will help him the label for what is wrong only contributes to his lack of self importance. Labeling kids in my opinion is one of the most horrible thing that our society does. It is a travisty. It doesn't matter what the label is all that matters is knowing how to improve functionality.His brain is in all technicality *NOT* broken. And is functioning within normal perameters. Do not let these quacks and their witch hunt be such a disruption to yourself or your child is my best advise. Ask them rather than what is wrong with him, to tell you *how* he learns. What methods can be used for his improvement. As classification and a name for a fictional brain abnormality is only going to cause more damage. The day the quacks provide real prood of ADHD rather than the spectral evidence used during, Mcartheism, the war on terror, the Salem witch trials, the holocaust, the old days of african americans used so wrongly as slaves...... All of these things, predicated on causing people to fear. America signed away the civil liberties it has always loved so much for security to a bunch of dishonest tools. All because they were told to be afraid very afraid... Seriously, one of the experts i saw as teenager actually told my mother i would get ebola from having ADHD. Acording to him it would turn into HIV and then AIDS. BUT if i took Ritalin i would be fine... Well.... It really is upto you. Whatever he is he is still himself. He is still the owner of a fully functional brain. A different kind of functioning is hardly a disability. It is only a difference. I don't know why people get so hyped about it....

In 5th grade, i had both ADHD and Dyslexia. My standardized test scores were so high (though i couldn't read fluently till the year before) that i was scoring 10 grade science and higher on other subjects. I was sooo ADHD and dyslexic and intellectually inferior, i was declared one of the 50 most intelligent kids in my city and state and a special program was offered to me which would have included more homework, so i laughed and said no thank you!

These labels, contrary to what on e is lead to believe are not the end of the world and it is of a great deal of importance to preserve your child's sense of normalness. He needs you to protect that normalness for him. That is what you should be getting worked up about.... You should be ofcourse doing all you can to get him any help he needs, without ruining his fragile young sense of self, by letting such labels and fear mongering cause you to get so worked up.

So he has ADHD... Oh no... It isn't brain cancer. It seems based on what empirical evidence there is it isn't even related to the brain. He is your child, not some sdcary alien from outer space.... What do *you* think it is??? If you stop, and take some time to try to see calmly from his perspective..... How his life is how is your view different? This might help you understand him better. Ask him questions notice how he takes cues best. I have a very mildly harder time with visual cues sometimes. But i understand everything spoken and rwritten. Your son's only flaw is believing himself flawed due to these labels.... Rather than labeling him, engage his creative mind as most with ADHD are exceptionally creative, to figure out not what is 'wrong with him' (focusing on a negative) But instead ask him to evaluate class and his teacher. Ask him to evaluate the text. Ask him too to think about what methods he finds most effective for himself. This is something that he will need to understand for the rest of his life. As if he is as functional as everyone else weather he wears a label or not is rather irrelevant isn't it? Focus on how to reach that goal rather than what is different about him that is negative that makes him less able. Best of luck and to your son as well. If he ever needs to talk to anyone else labeled.... I have been through it all and i am always very straight with my thoughts, but i am also here to help when i can as i have suffered so much from labels.

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Mandi
Joined May 05, 2008
Posts: 424

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Posted:Jun 04, 2008 3:09:54 AM

Yes i got me a good clue.... He has ORPD. A very common disability often found along with OCD dyslexia and or the goddess forbidden ADHD! That would be Over Reactive Parent Disorder.

Seriously, start by taking a few deep breaths. Whatever is going on with him, is *less* likely to work out good if you get worked up. Also, getting worked up over LD serves no good purpose as many with LD are hardly disabled. They lead full and wonderful lives many even as professionals in many fields and as academics. You are going to be ok. So is your son. If he has made it this long, with a little help he will make it though. But if your lose it, so will he. You set the tone. How you do that is by staying calm, no matter what is happening.

First of all don't worry about Dyslexia. It sounds to me unlikely as from what i know about it, it seems to affect written and read language far more than verbal and auditory issues. It sounds to me, like his teacher is just another boring old bat with no business teaching, combined with the issue of another kind that is simple to fix. It sounds as if his vocabulary is behind or that his teacher is teaching non grade apropriate books. This is easy to solve. Get his book from his teacher in advance. Give him from the texts, vocabulary words to look up and learn. You can't get too hyper about it just a small handfull at a time.

As you say he is ADHD, there is no evidence of the organic existence of this disorder what so ever that has not been refuted by real and proper science of a non seudo nature. He may have trouble focusing.... I have my own personal theory about this disorder. I think, when a child is over exposed to hyper reactions they learn to always be on edge and just unfocused and impulsicve and copying the example which their earliest education exposed them to. I think ADHD is a learned behavior. And then when the parent freaks out further when the kid exhibits symptoms the symptoms continue to get worse as the child's education continues. But again, i am NOT an expert. I am just a woman who according to some has ADHD and according to others is fine. Not only am i supposed to be ADHD, but i am also a literally clinically dyslexic epigrapher who is passably to fluently literate in 6 additional languages (as my epigraphy focus is hieroglyphs hieratic script, and old coptic.) Also i am fluent in both ancient greek music notation as well as modern western music notation. These labels hold only the power you allow them to hold over your life as there is *no* evidence of any sort of brain difference of shape or structure or function which is accepted as proof of this disorder of ADHD anyway.

I don't know what it is.... But if he isn't making a mess of his letters, and he can read well enough to decode the words then it is likely in my opinion from what little i know, not dyslexia. As for comprehension.... I don't know... It sounds like he isn't overly verbal so possibly not so auditory? Maybe he would do better if he had a dictionary on hand read the book himself and looked up every word he finds that he doesn't know. The other possibility is, his teacher's taste in books blows the big one, and he is bored to tears.

If his reading skills are borderline i am afraid i don't know what you mean... Borderline grade level???? Border line what exactly? If grade level is your meaning maybe a tutor would help? I recoommed a Barbey doll that wears indecent shirts and has a very sexy accent. Suddenly all that ADHD will likely magically disapear.... I am sure too that if she likes the text he will find it very interesting rather suddenly. Hormones and teenagers...

I personally doubt anything is wrong with him. And even if he *is* dyslexic... uhhh so what??? What difference does it make? What matters is finding an understanding of what methodology will help him the label for what is wrong only contributes to his lack of self importance. Labeling kids in my opinion is one of the most horrible thing that our society does. It is a travisty. It doesn't matter what the label is all that matters is knowing how to improve functionality.His brain is in all technicality *NOT* broken. And is functioning within normal perameters. Do not let these quacks and their witch hunt be such a disruption to yourself or your child is my best advise. Ask them rather than what is wrong with him, to tell you *how* he learns. What methods can be used for his improvement. As classification and a name for a fictional brain abnormality is only going to cause more damage. The day the quacks provide real prood of ADHD rather than the spectral evidence used during, Mcartheism, the war on terror, the Salem witch trials, the holocaust, the old days of african americans used so wrongly as slaves...... All of these things, predicated on causing people to fear. America signed away the civil liberties it has always loved so much for security to a bunch of dishonest tools. All because they were told to be afraid very afraid... Seriously, one of the experts i saw as teenager actually told my mother i would get ebola from having ADHD. Acording to him it would turn into HIV and then AIDS. BUT if i took Ritalin i would be fine... Well.... It really is upto you. Whatever he is he is still himself. He is still the owner of a fully functional brain. A different kind of functioning is hardly a disability. It is only a difference. I don't know why people get so hyped about it....

In 5th grade, i had both ADHD and Dyslexia. My standardized test scores were so high (though i couldn't read fluently till the year before) that i was scoring 10 grade science and higher on other subjects. I was sooo ADHD and dyslexic and intellectually inferior, i was declared one of the 50 most intelligent kids in my city and state and a special program was offered to me which would have included more homework, so i laughed and said no thank you!

These labels, contrary to what on e is lead to believe are not the end of the world and it is of a great deal of importance to preserve your child's sense of normalness. He needs you to protect that normalness for him. That is what you should be getting worked up about.... You should be ofcourse doing all you can to get him any help he needs, without ruining his fragile young sense of self, by letting such labels and fear mongering cause you to get so worked up.

So he has ADHD... Oh no... It isn't brain cancer. It seems based on what empirical evidence there is it isn't even related to the brain. He is your child, not some sdcary alien from outer space.... What do *you* think it is??? If you stop, and take some time to try to see calmly from his perspective..... How his life is how is your view different? This might help you understand him better. Ask him questions notice how he takes cues best. I have a very mildly harder time with visual cues sometimes. But i understand everything spoken and rwritten. Your son's only flaw is believing himself flawed due to these labels.... Rather than labeling him, engage his creative mind as most with ADHD are exceptionally creative, to figure out not what is 'wrong with him' (focusing on a negative) But instead ask him to evaluate class and his teacher. Ask him to evaluate the text. Ask him too to think about what methods he finds most effective for himself. This is something that he will need to understand for the rest of his life. As if he is as functional as everyone else weather he wears a label or not is rather irrelevant isn't it? Focus on how to reach that goal rather than what is different about him that is negative that makes him less able. Best of luck and to your son as well. If he ever needs to talk to anyone else labeled.... I have been through it all and i am always very straight with my thoughts, but i am also here to help when i can as i have suffered so much from labels.

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majorv
Joined Jun 01, 2008
Posts: 26

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Posted:Jun 04, 2008 2:24:13 PM

Obviously my post was misunderstood. My son was very close to failing English because of this problem. Most of the books covered in class are read to them. He is pretty nonchalant about school, but he is concerned about his inability to keep up with the rest of the class, and the next two years will be even harder. I just wanted input from someone who is more familiar with reading and auditory issues than me. By the way, the book in question, Night, was about the experiences of a Holocaust survivor. Not boring by any means.

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Kathryn
Joined Oct 02, 2006
Posts: 172

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Posted:Jun 04, 2008 6:57:36 PM

It could be an auditory processing problem, but before jumping to that conclusion I would watch carefully if he has auditory processing problems in any other area. If not, and his language skills are now up to speed, then maybe getting him some additional help after school or some accommodations would be helpful. The ADHD could just set him over the edge if he is even slightly bored with the content. Not saying he is, but I'd ask him how he feels about the content. I was always completely bored in high school English, except anything grammar related. I was a slow reader, though, and I don't recall the teacher reading TO us.

Dyslexia usually appears with decoding problems, not auditory problems. You could have his auditory processing tested, especially with a history of a language problem.

Could he get a list of what will be covered next year prior to summer starting and maybe get a head start on some of the reading? I know how difficult it is once you get lost by not understanding a word or 2, then the rest is a waste of time.

Kathryn

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scifinut
Joined Jul 11, 2005
Posts: 550

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Posted:Jun 04, 2008 7:56:03 PM

It is possible he has APD (Auditory Processing Disorder) which is interfering with his ability to understand things clearly. http://www.exploratorium.edu/exhibits/ladle/index.html this site shows visually what someone with auditory issues might be hearing. This may not effect him as much in short conversations or instructions but be more apparent when he has to listen to long passages.

Secondly, it is possible to have auditory dyslexia. It was among my dd's list when she had neuropsych testing. Its called Dysphonetic Dyslexia and is related to the Auditory issues.

My dd just had to read Night and found it very boring. She had to really push herself to read it. She loved Lord of the Flies, though.

You may want to encourage your son to read the book on his own rather than just listening to it as the teacher reads. He is likely to get more out of what he reads himself.

I would also look at accommodations for him. Is he getting any help for the comprehension issues?

scifinut mom to: ms 16, bp/adhd/anxiety/complex ld mr. 20, add/dyslexic I hear and I forget I see and I remember I do and I understand. -Anonymous

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majorv
Joined Jun 01, 2008
Posts: 26

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Posted:Jun 10, 2008 6:22:02 PM

I should probably get a reading assessment done on him if nothing else because I suspect his reading fluency is low. He has the usual ADHD accommodations but nothing related to reading/comprehension issues. He did complain to me that in two of his other classes the teacher didn't explain things so he could understand it. Whether it was an auditory issue or they were talking 'over his head', I don't know. I see his psychologist this week so I may ask her opinion on whether it warrants a consult with an SLP.

Thanks for the input!

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majaw
Joined Aug 21, 2003
Posts: 54

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Posted:Jun 11, 2008 2:31:15 AM

Vicki,

In your post you said that your son struggles to follow along in class when a book is being read to him. And, you mentioned that your son's reading language skills are 'adequate', his reading fluency borderline and his comprehension is low average.

Some observations of my own that might help ...

I listen to books on tape a lot when I'm doing dishes and I've learned to follow along with the story fine as long as I can concentrate BUT I have a difficult time following along when someone is reading out loud from a book or newspaper, etc. at a quick pace. Maybe, the teacher really does read faster than his brain processes. An easy solution may be for him to read the book outside class at his own pace OR listen to the same book recorded on CD or tape.

My ds who is dyslexic and a slow reader does this regularly. In fact, he prefers listening to reading. Most of the books he's been required to read are available at the public library on CD. If they haven't been available and sometimes even if they have I've reread all or part of them to him at home in the evening and we've discussed the story line and the words I wasn't sure he knew the meaning of.

The other thing you mentioned is that your son has low average comprehension. In high school students are expected to not only read the story and understand it but also begin to look at it for "deeper meaning." If he is struggling just to keep pace with the reader and struggling with the "big words" he is going to miss both the story line and the deeper meanings they expect them to start looking for. He may struggle to understand the things like symbolism, conflict (man vs. man, man vs. nature) and the like.

Maybe, someone should read the books with him at home and discuss the story, the meaning of the words and maybe even some of the deeper meanings. I know it takes extra time but it helps my son a lot.

Just because the book being read is Night doesn't mean it is something your son is interested in. Some of the books my son has been required to read have not been all that interesting to either of us.

Maja

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Mandi
Joined May 05, 2008
Posts: 424

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Posted:Jun 18, 2008 3:47:54 PM

Yeh! Last paragraph. Not all books rock. Ever tried The Red Badge Of Courage??? Horrible horrible book. All about some stupid civil war guy who ran away from the war and still got injured the bloody wound was his badge of courage. But it is a terrible and boring book. I am sure it has inspired many people to commit suicide in its unbelievable boringness. It almost had me!

Then Lord Of The Flies. From 6th grade till 12th grade they made me read it upwards of *5* times. That is nowhere as bad as what they did with The Catcher In The Rye. Which i read in every grade from 4th through 12th a *minimum* of once a year. I can not look at that book without becoming bored and nausious at the same time. It was a horrid book the first time i read it. By the 17th tinme i read it.... It had gotten more than 17 times worse and more boring. Seriously, they say that every serial killer has a copy of Catcher in The Rye, and that many have some sort of Holden complex. What were they trying to do when i was in school??? Create a class of 25 serial killers??? It didn't work. All it did, is made me unwilling to even allow my future children to read it. It is the only banned book in my house.

Ïf you want to get someone to pay attention to a book and to find the deeper meanings try teaching them with The Mists Of Avalon. Its better than the bible. (But that last bit is just a personal opinion we all have our own private feelings on the ummm 'good book' our moral compass filled with murder rape incest and violence.) You see, not all books are created equal Not all people can sit through the great gatsby without wishing to be hit by an old fashioned car themselves. Schools should be forced to take good taste into account in their teaching materials.

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majorv
Joined Jun 01, 2008
Posts: 26

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Posted:Jul 09, 2008 9:16:25 AM

Just a follow up - we did have an SLP do some testing. We found out that he definitely has a receptive language problem. The CELF-4 showed receptive @ 64 (norm=100) and expressive @ 91. His ST auditory memory tested very low and he also reads at a 6th grade level. I don't really understand how the school SLP could say his language skills were adequate (she used the CASL but only did the core tests). I'm just glad the school won't be able to blame the whole problem on his ADHD. Both SLP's noted that he was able to stay on task during the session. With him being in a public high school, I don't expect a whole lot...we'll see. I'm sure I'll be reading the book assignments so I can help him..I'm not sure how successful he would be with books on tape, though.

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scifinut
Joined Jul 11, 2005
Posts: 550

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Posted:Jul 09, 2008 10:25:01 AM

Try Text-To-Speech programs for the books. With his disability you can get an application for http://www.bookshare.org/web/Welcome.html which offers E-books for people with disabilities. There is a yearly fee but its not much. There are many text-to-speech programs available to try. Find one that he likes.

Books on tape never worked for my dd but the TTS programs helped a lot because she could visually track and listen to the book on the computer. It also gave her the benefit of being able to mark text that was important so she could take notes.

I'm glad you got the testing done. Hopefully he will now get some more help! :)

scifinut mom to: ms 16, bp/adhd/anxiety/complex ld mr. 20, add/dyslexic I hear and I forget I see and I remember I do and I understand. -Anonymous

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ricky
Joined Jul 28, 2008
Posts: 1

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Posted:Jul 28, 2008 6:40:00 AM

Hi,

Well after reading this what i can suggest you is that make your son practice at home. Even you can make him practice to read lips. Just show him television with mute on and tell him to try and understand what he/she is speaking.

Ricky
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http://www.treatmentcenters.org/alabama

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