What would be considered a “complete” language evaluation?
The school never did a language eval for my oldest boy. So, months back, our pediatrician ordered a language eval through our Children’s Hospital.
The only test performed was the CELF-3 and the diagnosis was a severe delay in receptive language.
Submitted the results to the school. At our transition meeting for him last week (going into Jr. High) next year, two things happened regarding this test.
1. They refused to accept the diagnosis. The speech-language pathologist said such a delay cannot be determined by 1 test. She also said that because he got upset during the test (because he honestly could not do one part of the test) that the findings are invalid.
Now, to me his total frustration interprets disability in the area of receptive language that the test was “testing.” He honestly could not do it. I was there during the testing. The school pathologist insists that the test should have been stopped at that poing and resumed another day. I’m not surprised, though, they have balked at all of our outside testing.
But now we have to put him through all of this again to meet their satisfaction of the diagnosis.
2. Even though they disagree with the diagnosis, they say he qualifies for language services. (((WHAT?))). So that will begin when school resumes next week and she will begin her assessment. She will also be contacting the pathologist from the hospital (supposedly) to voice her disagreement and ask some questions.
Does all of this make sense, or are they buying time. My husband’s thinking is that they are trying to cover up something they missed but not evaluating him in the first place.
I just want to know if what they tell me about the diagnosis being invalid is true. Because if it is not, then I won’t let them continue to poke and prod at him for their satisfaction.
Any opinions?
Re: "complete" language evaluation
Hi, Lulu,
As usual, I have an opinion. ;-)
This time, I’ll have to agree with the school personnel, which I know is contrary to my normal opinion! One test does NOT make a complete language evaluation. Now, I’ll say it is quite likely that he DOES have a langauge delay (you are checking the younger one for APD, right?), but you definitely need more thn one test. I think my state requires confirmation from two or more tests to place S/L impaired. I think if the CELF showed a receptive delay, then I’d like to see a TAPS-R and a maybe CTOPP if his reading is delayed. I’m not a SLP, so maybe there are better things for his age.
Unfortunately, because of his age, he won’t get much in the area of langauge services at school. You will still need to probably get outside help. I get your kids confused, so I don’t remember if he has a reading disorder or whether he has any learning disabilites. His total set of weaknesses should determine what therapy would be best for him (ex: Orton Gillingham, LB, PG, etc.). You might want to post a little more about him to get some other opinions about services. He also may need an APD evaluation if the receptive delay is confirmed.
Janis
Re: "complete" language evaluation
Hi, Lulu,
As usual, I have an opinion. ;-)
This time, I’ll have to agree with the school personnel, which I know is contrary to my normal opinion! One test does NOT make a complete language evaluation. Now, I’ll say it is quite likely that he DOES have a langauge delay (you are checking the younger one for APD, right?), but you definitely need more thn one test. I think my state requires confirmation from two or more tests to place S/L impaired. I think if the CELF showed a receptive delay, then I’d like to see a TAPS-R and a maybe CTOPP if his reading is delayed. I’m not a SLP, so maybe there are better things for his age.
Unfortunately, because of his age, he won’t get much in the area of langauge services at school. You will still need to probably get outside help. I get your kids confused, so I don’t remember if he has a reading disorder or whether he has any learning disabilites. His total set of weaknesses should determine what therapy would be best for him (ex: Orton Gillingham, LB, PG, etc.). You might want to post a little more about him to get some other opinions about services. He also may need an APD evaluation if the receptive delay is confirmed.
Janis
Re: "complete" language evaluation
Sorry, don’t know why that posted twice. Just wanted to add that Lisa’s sons five test evaluation looks much more appropriate to me.
Janis
Re: "complete" language evaluation
My son qualified for language help last year(mid4th grade)after I requested several other tests through the school(scored at 1% on one of them)
I felt vindicated and thats about it!
Now, mind you, he already receives speech for artic disorders(9 yrs of speech and counting) so the SLP said nothing would change as they already address language during speech and there was no time to do more
A total washout here
BTW, looked for the dyslexia book you recommended-it is at a neighboring library and I WILL get it soon but I picked up “In the Mind’s Eye” by Thomas West this week. Had the same epiphany you did-this is my son and why dont they use the word ‘dyslexia’ when its such a good fit?
Plan to question when school resumes. The ‘by the time I’m to the end of a sentence, Ive forgotten the beginning’ comment of one party was so fitting-I never knew memory issues were part of dyslexia
Also, I see my son as naive and immature-nothing Ive read on any disorders have addressed this and this dyslexia book actually addressed it.
His teachers balked when I said this(immature)because he is a good kid who hands in his work and, understandably, that is maturity in their eyes
I see a sweet amiable child who could be led down the wrong path so easily and be totally clueless. He made a birthday card for his teen brother with “You don’t know how much I love you” written inside. Sooo sweet, but 11 yr old boys dont do this….I fear public middle school will eat him alive(Ive had two ‘normal’ boys go through ms already)!
Seriously investigating homeschooling for 6th grade next fall. Its either that or private school and we decided it would be cheaper for me to go half time and homeschool than pay privaet school tuition. At least thats THIS WEEKs plan ;)
I enjoy your posts because our boys are the same age
Go figure?
I had asked for a ‘complete’ language eval for my dd when she was in 1st grade by the school. They ONLY did a CELF and ONLY used 3 subtests for receptive and 3 for expressive. From their test, they determined that she did not have any language problems.
I argued that they did not do a ‘complete’ testing and how could they determine this with only one test?
So I would agree with your school that the CELF alone is not enough. BUT, since the Hospital did find a receptive problem with the subtests they did, then this should trigger/signal more indepth testing to be done on the receptive language piece.
We also had a VERY complete speech and Language eval that we had done thru a private SLP. I would recommend that you find a private SLP in your area. It cost us $300 and many times you can get insurance to pay for. I think it was like 1.5hrs to administer.
Our private S&L included the following tests:
Expressive One Word Picture Vocabulary Test
Peabody Picture Vocabulary Test
The Token Test for Children
Wide Range Assessment of Memory and Learning
Number-Letter Memory
Store Memory
Test of Language Development
Oral Vocabulary, Grammatic Understanding, Word Discrimination, Word Articulation
Nepsy - Comprehension of Instructions, Verbal Fluency, Phonological Processing
Note: Store Memory and Word Discrimination she could not complete - they were so hard for her, she could not get a score on. This was very key for us - we really focused on Memory and Discrimination in her remediation and now she she scores in the 70%.
Also, if you don’t agree with the school’s testing and have valid concerns, you can opt for an IEE at their expense.
Re: "complete" language evaluation
My son’s evaluations (had two- one at the age of 7 an done at the age of 10) included:
CLEF (at 7 and 10), Test of Auditory Perceptual Skills (TAPR-R)(at age fo 7), Peabody Picture Vocabulary-III (at 7 and 10), Comprehensive Test of Phonological Processing (age 10) and listening test (age 10), There were also comments about his answers, and pragmatics. The tester also asked him to tell what his favorite movie was and actually comments about his performance on this task were very usuful (they confirmed what we had observed and raised as an issue- almost complete lack of sequencing in retelling). She had also made comments that although his scores did not look that bad (average and below average for digit and word memory and RAN), she commented that it took him several attempts to arrive at a correct answer and he needed revisions to find a proper word; also usage of “stuff”, “thing” et.c. vs. a proper name. Both evaluations were done at school.
We also had in hand some tests that were done during his neuropsychological evaluation (like California Verbal Learning Aptitude_?_ do not remember the exact name) and the RAN was also identified at that time.
Re: can you give me specifics on how you remediated memory?
Sorry- I am just now catching up on the board - was out of town.
We did several things - Tomatis Sound Therapy,Brainbuilder, Earobics, Audiblox and PACE. It became clear that alot of her memory issues stemmed from word discrimination(could not understand most of what she was hearing) and as well as not being able to retain alot of information at one time (her digit span was that of a 3 year old at age 6).
Tomatis was very key for us.
When my oldest son finally received his complete speech/language evaluation here is what is comprised of:
Behavioral Observation: Child is friendly, coopperative and responsive. He did appear unorganized and confused during transitions.
Oral Peripheral Examination: Within normal limits for speech production.
Articulation: No specific areas noted, child speech was slightly muffled and slurred at times, particulary when answers were not known.
Voice: Quality within normal limits; low volume utilized.
Fluency: No difficulties noted.
Language: PPVT: Standard score 99, age equivelent 12-4/ Expressive Vocab test: Standard score 89; age equivalent 10-3/ The WORD test: Standard score for total test 75/ CELF: Receptive lang. standard score-100; expressive language standard score-94/ TOPS: standard score 74, age equivelalent-below test norms.
Informal obestrvations/consultations: None
Summary/Recommendations: Childs naming vocabulary (basic naming and identification skills are within average range to low average range. Specific language strengths identified by the CELF include following specific directions involving concept knowledge, unerstanding word classes, semantic relationships, and fromulating and assembling sentences. Difficulties with this test were in areas of sentence recall, recall of information in paragraphs and orally presented materials. The areas most difficult for the child were those items requiring reasoning and problem solving. General organizational skills are very weak. At this time it is not recommended that he be pulled from his classroom setting to receive language therapy. It is felt that his needs would be better addressed by maintaining continuity with his daily schedule and addressing organizational and problem solving difficulties through the curriculum based materials and the social enviroment in classroom group situations.
My sons dx’s are ADHD, inattentive type, CAPD, and dyslexia. I thought this report was very helpful and very readable and gave different tests to pinpoint strengths and weaknesses. This can not be done with one test or one observation by a specialist. My son does have an average full scale IQ of 95 so the standard scores on the tests where he received a 74 and 75 qualified him for accomodations in the classroom. I hope this helps. Good luck.